Penn Holderness Talks About New Book ‘All You Can Be with ADHD’

A podcast interview with Penn Holderness discussing All You Can Be with ADHD on The Growing Readers Podcast, a production of The Children’s Book Review.

What if the thing that makes you feel “weird” is actually what makes you awesome?

Penn Holderness—content creator, podcaster, and New York Times bestselling author—joins Bianca to share his deeply personal ADHD journey, from chewing on a fly swatter at his grandmother’s funeral to creating a children’s book that reframes diagnosis as an invitation to join the coolest club around. With disarming honesty, Penn reveals why ADHD is a delay (not a deficit), how his “deeply feeling” nature shaped his childhood struggles, and why understanding executive function development changes everything for kids who think they’re broken.

Whether you’re parenting an ADHD kid, teaching one, or simply want to understand the wild, creative brilliance of neurodivergent brains, this conversation will make you rethink what “different” really means—and why it’s worth celebrating.

Subscribe to The Growing Readers Podcast to ensure you never miss an episode celebrating the creators shaping young readers’ lives.

Listen to the Episode

The Show Notes

All You Can Be with ADHD

Written by Penn and Kim Holderness

Illustrated by Vin Vogel

Ages 4+ | 40 Pages

Publisher: Little, Brown Books for Young Readers | ISBN-13: 978-0316597678

Publisher’s Book Summary: An INSTANT New York Times Bestseller and USA TODAY Bestseller!

From the New York Times bestselling authors of ADHD Is Awesome comes an empowering and joyful picture book that invites young readers to join the ADHD Club—a celebration of creativity, resilience, and the endless possibilities that come with thinking differently!  

Welcome to the ADHD Club! 

If your brain’s like ours, then you may be different. You may be fantastic, you may be vociferant! If your brain’s like ours, you might struggle with concentration. But only because you’re finding some true inspiration! If your brain’s like ours, you’ll soon see . . . you’re not alone with your ADHD. 

Written in playful rhyme and filled with humor, this story will help young readers who have been diagnosed with ADHD (or who have someone they care about with ADHD) feel seen, understood, and empowered to embrace their pretty cool brains.

Buy the Book

Additional Books Mentioned:

ADHD Is Awesome by Penn Holderness and Kim Holderness:  Amazon or Bookshop.org

About Penn and Kim Holderness

Penn and Kim Holderness are social media creators, New York Times bestselling authors, award-winning podcasters, game creators, and winners of The Amazing Race. Their viral videos have garnered over three billion views and have been featured on Good Morning America, the Today show, Fox News Channel, and CNN. The Holderness family currently lives in Raleigh, North Carolina, with their children, Lola and PC, and their dog, Sunny. They invite you to visit them online at theholdernessfamily.com.

Episode Credits:

Host: Bianca Schulze

Guest: Penn Holderness

Audio Editor: Kelly Rink

Producer: Bianca Schulze

Read the Transcript

Bianca Schulze: Hi, Penn. Welcome to The Growing Readers Podcast.

Penn Holderness: Hi, Bianca. It is an honor. You are so important for this space. I enjoy all of it. I love your books. I’m happy to be here.

Bianca Schulze: I love diversifying the voices that I’m talking to. And so not only am I excited to dig into your book because of the topic of ADHD, but I love that you are so influential out in the world, just having fun with your wife, Kim.

And as social media creators, how cool to say that you’re both New York Times bestselling authors.

Penn Holderness: Wild. I mean, particularly, I think for a topic like ADHD that we’ve had—we’ve had literary agents and we’ve had publishers use the term “niche,” like, “Are you sure you want to do a niche book?” And we were like, “Yeah, I think that there are more people who are dealing with this than you might know.” So we were pleasantly surprised that both books got so well received.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, absolutely. Well, I mean, with all the things that you’re doing—award-winning podcast too—and I know that you’ve created some games. So I just have to ask the basic question: What does a typical day even look like for you and Kim? Because I mean, you’ve got so many things going on.

Penn Holderness: Yeah, the typical day is not a typical day. So if we’re having a typical day, that’s atypical. I think the most basic structure that we have, which gets blown into smithereens most times, is we’ll get together with our team. We have a very small team of four people, and we will talk about what sort of new ideas we have, how we want to execute them, and then talk about some of the big-picture stuff as well.

But essentially every week we try to come up with three pieces of new content, which are videos. We always put a podcast out there, and then we try to have some time every week to talk about bigger-picture items like books. In some cases, we have some games, we make shirts, we’re working on a live show. And so we try to have room for that on days like Thursday or Friday. But if something—you know, if we start the meeting and something really wild is going on that we need to get a video out, we just stop everything and we start working on how to script that and shoot it, and it usually goes out within 24 hours.

Bianca Schulze: Wow, that’s pretty—I mean, that turnaround, that’s fast. Because I mean, it takes more than what probably the average person thinks to pull together a good-quality video. And I have to say, this morning, I guess my devices knew that we were talking today. So the first video that popped up on my Instagram feed was you guys doing your Tracy Chapman version of …

Penn Holderness: “Trash Car.” Yeah, that’s doing well because apparently everyone else is living in that same season as ours where you’ve got kids who just think that it’s a locker room back there.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, exactly. And the metal water bottles rolling around on the car mats. Yeah.

Penn Holderness: Yeah, I mean, yeah, that song wrote itself pretty quickly, and honestly, we started writing that one less than a week ago. So that was another one where we’re like, “This is good. Let’s fast-track this.”

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, perfect. Well, let’s dig into this book. So you mention in the book’s author’s note that you didn’t know you had ADHD as a kid. And I’m going to quote you: You felt like “no one in history was as weird as I was.” So when did you finally get diagnosed, and what was that moment like for you?

Penn Holderness: Yeah, so I got diagnosed in between my junior and senior year in college. I’d already been on academic probation twice. You know, just college for me was a little rough. I think looking back on it, when you’re in a giant amphitheater or a huge auditorium for a class and you’re sitting near the back row, that’s not really helping your ability to hold focus. And so I struggled academically.

But what had happened that got me diagnosed was I was at a funeral for my grandmother, and our family was sitting around talking about, like, “What are we going to do about our summer vacations that we go on?” And I was stressed out, sad, thinking about my grandmother. And I got so spaced out that I was chewing on a used fly swatter. And my aunt called me out on it in the middle of the meeting, and everyone laughed. I’m glad people laughed. Like, it was funny. Like, why am I chewing on a fly swatter? But that was a good example of thinking, “Man, I know I’m weird, but this is now bordering on clinically disgusting.” And so I drove myself to a doctor. I know that’s not how most kids get diagnosed. And I guess I was a young adult at that point. And it was a fairly clear diagnosis. I’ll tell you that I loved having an explanation for why my brain was like that. But back then in the ’90s, it wasn’t a great explanation. It was more of a medical diagnosis. “Here’s your problem. You’re having trouble paying attention. You’re interrupting your friends. Here’s a drug.

I’m going to give this to you, hope it works, check in with me in a year.” Rather than, “This is a different brain type that you have. There are some upsides to it. There are some systems that you can put in place to manage it.” Back then it was more of a medical diagnosis. In the last 30 years, doctors, therapists, coaches have gotten so good at giving people resources to actually make the most of their brain.

I wonder what my life would have been like if I’d gotten that sort of support when I was diagnosed.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, well, maybe my next question is already pretty much answered, but what made you decide that now is the right time to write a children’s book about ADHD? And was there a specific moment or a conversation starter that you were like, “Okay, now is the time”?

Penn Holderness: Two things. Number one, we wrote an adult version of the book, just called ADHD Is Awesome. And when we went on the signing tour, we had an unbelievable outcome of people who wanted to show up, and a lot of them were kids. And so many of them—their parents were reading the book and their parents were trying to explain the book to them. And the kids, you could tell they wanted to learn. Like, they showed up with this—so here’s the book that we had. And there were these post-it notes on every kid. They had post-it notes of places where they could understand the book.

And this happened dozens of times. We would find kids with that. And the parents would pull us aside and say, “Hey, can you guys do maybe a kids’ version of this so they can understand it? So that when they first find out that they have this sort of brain, there’s a resource that they can look at that’s not really super dense and difficult to understand.” We think that this book is easy to understand, but maybe not easy for a five-year-old to understand.

The second big thing was my son was diagnosed, and I tried to imagine, like, “Okay, what’s the best resource I could give him where, you know, he could read it and understand with some humor and hope and self-awareness what lies ahead and that it’s not all bad?”

Bianca Schulze: Yes, that’s the part I love most about it. So it uses a really creative framing device. And so there’s an ADHD clubhouse in a tree with sharks, ninjas, and a snake playing the fiddle. So how did you land on that kind of playful approach, that imaginative approach of the clubhouse?

Penn Holderness: I’ve always thought of ADHD as a club, as a group of people. I mean, anytime you had a club in middle school, especially if you’re an ADHDer, a lot of times it’s guys and girls who maybe aren’t like everybody else, right? Think of it like the drama club or the theater arts club. That was what I joined when I was younger. People who weren’t sure why they were drawn to each other, but were able to kind of live creatively and have fun. And I think, you know, we wanted to make it feel like a place where you belong rather than a diagnosis that separates you.

And the sharks and the ninjas and the snake playing the fiddle—I mean, that’s just the wild imagination that comes with ADHD. You know, our brains go to these weird places, and we wanted to celebrate that rather than suppress it. So the clubhouse became this visual representation of “This is your people. This is where you fit in.”

Bianca Schulze: I love that so much. And I think it’s such a powerful reframe from what a lot of kids might be getting elsewhere. So in the book, you talk about some of the challenges of ADHD, but you also highlight the superpowers. Can you talk a little bit about what you see as the upsides of having an ADHD brain?

Penn Holderness: Yeah, I mean, the creativity is off the charts. Like, I think about some of the most creative people I know, and a lot of them have ADHD. The ability to hyperfocus when something interests you—like, when I’m in the zone, I can work for hours and hours and not even notice time passing. The energy—like, that energy that can sometimes be disruptive can also be channeled into really productive things.

And then there’s this resilience that comes from having to figure out workarounds your whole life. Like, if you’ve been struggling with executive function since you were little, you develop these creative problem-solving skills that neurotypical people might not have. You learn to adapt. You learn to be flexible. And I think that’s a huge advantage in life.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, absolutely. So you mentioned executive function, and I know that’s a term that comes up a lot when people talk about ADHD. Can you explain what that means and how it affects kids with ADHD?

Penn Holderness: Yeah, so executive function is basically the management system of your brain. It’s what helps you plan, organize, manage time, regulate emotions, all of those things. And in people with ADHD, that part of the brain develops more slowly. So you might have a 10-year-old who intellectually is at a 10-year-old level, but their executive function might be more like a 7-year-old.

And that’s where a lot of the challenges come in. It’s not that they don’t want to remember to bring their backpack home or turn in their homework. It’s that the part of their brain that helps them do those things is still developing. And I think when parents and teachers understand that, it changes the conversation from “Why aren’t you trying harder?” to “What systems can we put in place to help you succeed?”

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, that’s such an important distinction. And you mentioned in your answer to my earlier question that this is a delay, not a deficit. Can you talk more about that?

Penn Holderness: Yeah, that’s the key thing I want people to take away from this conversation. It’s a delay. The executive function will catch up—maybe not completely, but it will get there. And I think that gives hope to parents who are in the thick of it with a kid who’s struggling.

Like, my ability to emotionally regulate was severely delayed. I would cry on the playground in second and third grade. I would tear up in middle school. It took until high school for me to not get overwhelmed emotionally. And at the time, I thought there was something seriously wrong with me. All of my friends thought I was a crybaby. But it was just that that part of my brain was delayed.

And now, as an adult, I’m—you know, I’m okay. I still have ADHD. It doesn’t go away. But that developmental delay has caught up, and I can function in the world. So for parents who are watching their kid struggle, just know that it’s going to get there. It’s not permanent dysfunction. It’s a delay.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, I think that’s so reassuring for parents to hear. So this book is obviously for kids with ADHD, but I’m curious—do you think it’s also a book that neurotypical kids should read?

Penn Holderness: Oh, absolutely. I mean, we’ve already seen this happening. There are quite a few teachers who are reading it to their entire class and then turning it into a discussion topic. We actually put together a curriculum for it—like a mini-curriculum, sort of a worksheet or workpage that you can download if you’re a teacher—and give them an opportunity to discuss this. And from what we’ve heard from teachers, the people that they were most surprised about were the neurotypical ones, just understanding it.

Because I think a lot of times, neurotypical kids see a kid with ADHD acting differently, and they don’t understand why. And sometimes they’ll push buttons to try to make sense of it. But if they understand, “Oh, this is how their brain works. This is why they’re doing this,” then there’s more empathy, more patience, more acceptance.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, I completely agree. I think understanding breeds empathy. So you mentioned earlier that your son was diagnosed with ADHD. What was that like for you as a parent who has ADHD yourself?

Penn Holderness: It was—I mean, it was bittersweet in a way because on one hand, I was sad for him that he was going to have to go through some of the same struggles I went through. But on the other hand, I was so glad that he was getting diagnosed early and that he would have resources that I didn’t have.

And I think it also gave me this motivation to create something for him, you know? Like, I wanted to give him a book that would help him understand his brain in a way that was hopeful and positive and fun, not just clinical and deficit-focused. And so that was a big part of why we wrote All You Can Be With ADHD.

Bianca Schulze: I love that. And I think it really comes through in the book—that sense of hope and celebration. So what do you hope kids take away from reading this book?

Penn Holderness: I hope they feel seen. I hope they feel like they’re not alone. I hope they understand that having ADHD doesn’t mean there’s something wrong with them—it just means their brain works differently. And I hope they feel excited about the possibilities, you know? Like, “I’m part of this cool club. I’ve got these superpowers. I can do amazing things with my brain.”

And I also hope they understand that there are going to be challenges, but that doesn’t mean they’re broken. It just means they might need to do things a little differently. And that’s okay.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah. All right, well, if you could go back and give your picture book to young Penn, what do you think would have changed for you?

Penn Holderness: Oh my gosh. Well, my mom would have had so much more free time. She would have—I think it would have really helped the emotional component. I am what Dr. Becky calls a “deeply feeling kid”—or was, I guess I still kind of am. I think once you’re a deeply feeling kid, you’re always a deeply feeling kid. And

it was problematic. Like, I would cry on the playground in second and third grade, but it—I mean, it stayed. Like, I teared up in middle school. It took until high school for me to not get overwhelmed emotionally. And part of it was just because I didn’t know why I was feeling this way. I didn’t know what was wrong with me. I didn’t understand why I got so high and so low so quickly.

And so I think just understanding, like, “We get upset and mad sometimes, but there’s hope on the other side”—I might have been a little more regulated emotionally. And, you know, it’s hard to make really good friends when you’re up and down like that. I don’t keep in touch with as many people that I knew when I was much younger. And so I might have had some older friends who could have put up with me because I understood what was going on.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, I don’t know. This is just an observation, and I’m not an expert in any way. But sometimes I feel as though, like, well, all kids are just trying to make sense of the world. And so I think sometimes when, you know, maybe a neurotypical kid sees a kid that is flooded with emotions, sometimes I think they’re trying to make sense of that and they almost push the buttons intentionally, I think, to try and make sense of the world. So as much as this book is for a kid that has ADHD, I think it’s such a wonderful book for all kids so that they can also understand maybe why somebody is acting differently. And maybe then they won’t intentionally go and push those buttons to try and make sense of what is going on with this other kid. That’s something that I feel this book is good for— supporting the neurotypical kid just so that they can have more understanding.

Penn Holderness: You’re so nice to say that, and we’ve already seen some of that happening. There are quite a few teachers who are reading it to their entire class and then turning it into a discussion topic. We actually put together a curriculum for it—like a mini-curriculum, sort of a worksheet or workpage that you can download if you’re a teacher—and give them an opportunity to discuss this. And from what we’ve heard from teachers, the people that they were most surprised about were the neurotypical ones, just understanding it.

Bianca Schulze: Of everything that we’ve spoken about today, you know, I mean, it’s hard for us all to take in everything. Whenever I listen to a podcast or read a book, there’s always one takeaway that always stands out to me. And also I just want to shout out—I love that you mentioned Dr. Becky.

Penn Holderness: Okay, thank you.

Bianca Schulze: And her book, Good Inside. I love that philosophy—every kid is good inside. So thank you for shouting that out. But with our conversation today and this particular picture book, what’s one thing that you want every listener to remember about ADHD after hearing our conversation?

Penn Holderness: Let’s go with: It is a delay. And look, there’s a ton of positive stuff that we talked about during this, but I always want people to understand that our executive functioning part of our brain is underdeveloped. And that goes on through most of childhood and adolescence, and it will catch up in some ways during adulthood. It’s how, you know, once you get to adulthood, you are kind of okay. It doesn’t mean your ADHD goes away. It just means that that part of the delay has caught up. And so I always encourage patience for kids and for people who are with these kids to know that it’s going to get there.

But like, my ability to emotionally regulate was severely delayed. And so for that reason, I thought there was something seriously wrong with me, and all of my friends thought that I was a crybaby. Right? That’s not great either way. That’s the term they used to describe me. And it happens more—that part of it, the emotional component—happens more in ADHD kids than people realize, because it’s not really in the definition of diagnosis. But as a parent, just know that it’s a delay. It’s not the complete absence of the ability to do all these things.

Bianca Schulze: Yeah, it’s just a delay. I do like that. Well, Penn, I love that you and Kim have created a book that makes kids feel like they’re joining a club rather than dealing with a diagnosis. And All You Can Be With ADHD truly does live up to its title because it shows kids not just how to cope with ADHD, but how to celebrate the unique ways that their brains work. So thank you to you and Kim so much for sharing your story and for creating such a joyful, honest resource for kids and families. And just a big, huge thank you for being here today.

Penn Holderness: You’re so sweet. Thank you. By the way, are you in Australia, or is that just where you’re from?

Bianca Schulze: No, I’m in Colorado in the United States. Awesome.

Penn Holderness: Okay. That’s still pretty far. Okay. Well, look, it was a pleasure. And again, thank you for making this resource available and this conversation. And the whole kids’ book thing is so much fun. I’m like—I can’t tell you how thrilled I am to be an author in this space and be able to talk about it.