Pok\u00e9mon<\/em>. But if that sounds fun for you, then you should head on over there. It\u2019ll be great.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I mean, my partner knows Pok\u00e9mon<\/em>, so he just wants to hear that all day. [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Excellent.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: All right. So, yeah, we\u2019re gonna talk about The Story of Saiunkoku<\/em>. This beginning section will be an attempt at being spoiler free. It\u2019s kind of hard to talk about some things without spoiling anything, but we\u2019ll do our best for anybody who has not read or watched the anime. So, Dee, would you like to give a plot synopsis?<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Sure, I can do that. Okay, so The Story of Saiunkoku<\/em>, as the name suggests, takes place in the land of Saiunkoku, which is a fantastical version of dynastic China. They never really specify because it\u2019s a fantasy series, but it\u2019s probably around 1000 AD, probably in the Song Dynasty, is the vibe I get from it.<\/p>\nThe story follows Shurei, a young woman from a well-to-do but poor family who has always wanted to be a public official, but can\u2019t because women aren\u2019t allowed to take the civil service exams. In the early going of the story, she is approached by a high-ranking official, Lord Sa, who gives her the task of turning the nation\u2019s new emperor into a responsible leader. The job pays really well, so she accepts because she needs to get some work done on the house and maybe have rice for dinner. And so she enters the emperor\u2019s inner court, officially as a consort, but unofficially as his political tutor.<\/p>\n
So, Shurei and Emperor Ryuki meet, and the story sort of spirals out from there as Shurei learns about Ryuki and the politics of the court and her place within it. And again, like you said, it\u2019s hard to talk about without spoiling too much, because the story really does build on itself in a very gradual but very natural and well-told way.\u00a0<\/p>\n
But just for folks at home, Shurei does not remain a consort for very long. That\u2019s sort of the entry point of the story. The overall story is much more focused on her dream of becoming a civil servant and what needs to happen to make that happen. So, it\u2019s more about her career goals\u2014you know, while she\u2019s hanging out with a lot of very pretty boys and thwarting some political schemes along the way, naturally. Naturally: it\u2019s a shoujo!<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Naturally! Duh. Yeah, I was like, it definitely does the shoujo thing where it has an initial premise and then after two volumes that premise is not necessarily the focus anymore, and you\u2019re like, \u201cOkay, we\u2019re still here for the ride.\u201d [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, yeah. I think a lot of that comes from\u2026 Because it is adapted from light novels, I think that you can very clearly feel the arcs in the manga where maybe the end of a volume\u2026 and then you get a different story. And so, the first volume really does feel like setup for what the main story is, which is Shurei trying to realize her dream of breaking the ol\u2019 glass ceiling and joining the court.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Also, the explanation that she just wants to buy some rice and fix up her house. I\u2019m like, \u201cRelatable.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Oh, yeah, absolutely. Shurei\u2019s a very relatable protagonist! She\u2019s one of the reasons I love this story so much.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah! So, I wanted to get a clearer sense of what level of familiarity you had with this series. Is this like the 50 millionth time you\u2019ve read it, have you watched the anime, and all this stuff.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, this is actually only the second time I\u2019ve read it. I\u2019ve watched the anime a few times prior, as well. I probably\u2026 I prefer the anime, but that\u2019s not the manga\u2019s fault. It\u2019s just that the anime\u2026 it\u2019s really well done and there\u2019s just more of it, so you get more of the story than the manga covers\u2014because again, they\u2019re based on ongoing light novels and so it\u2019s not officially complete, although I think they find a good stopping point in both versions.\u00a0<\/p>\nSo yeah, this is my second time coming to the manga, but it is a story that I have revisited a lot and it\u2019s very, very, very close to my heart. So, yeah, a fair bit of familiarity with it, I would say.<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Okay, and I will admit to listeners that this is the first time I have read it, and I have not watched the anime. I\u2019m very bad.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: No, that actually\u2026 that makes me happy. I\u2019m glad that this was an excuse to get you into it. So, that\u2019s great.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I know! I was like, \u201cHow did I miss this, though?\u201d It was never on my radar, even.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: I call it \u201cthe shoujo gem that time forgot\u201d because the anime came out right as the bottom dropped out of the industry in the mid-aughts. So, Geneon was bringing it out and then Geneon went under. And then there was a whole license reshuffle and we never got season 2.\u00a0<\/p>\nAnd then the manga came out at about the same time, but the manga industry wasn\u2019t as vibrant at that point either. It had also kind of dipped, and so, Viz released it on their Shojo Beat label, which makes it pretty easy to find, which is nice, but I just don\u2019t think it got a lot of hype because of the economic situation when it came out, which is very unfortunate.\u00a0<\/p>\n
And also, it\u2019s not a romance-forward series, which a lot of people, I think, look for, so maybe that put some people off because it\u2019s more of a political drama, right?<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah. No, totally. But that\u2019s why I\u2019m like, \u201cI should have read it sooner.\u201d<\/p>\n[Chuckling]<\/p>\n
DEE<\/strong>: Yeah, I think it\u2019s kind of an under-the-radar one just because of when it came out. It didn\u2019t ping on a lot of people\u2019s radars. But the people I know who did find it, love it!<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: That\u2019s the sense I get from the response we got from being like, \u201cWe\u2019re doing this!\u201d People were like, \u201cWhat a time! I remember this! Yay, I love it!\u201d [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, it has a small but passionate following, I would say, and I would definitely count myself as one of those people. I am constantly asking Seven Seas to bring over the light novels.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Okay! [Laughs] Nice. Well, yeah, we got a question from @sewingrose11 on Twitter, who asked, \u201cDo you feel the sense of longing that we\u2019re not getting the light novels in English as well?\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Oh, very much I feel that. Very much, I feel that sense of longing. Every day, I\u2019m like, \u201cCome on, guys! Just bring them over. I know there\u2019s like a million volumes, but come on, you can do it!\u201d\u00a0<\/p>\nThere\u2019s kind of been an uptick in fantastical Chinese court dramas in the light novel world recently, stuff like The Apothecary Diaries<\/em> and Culinary Chronicles<\/em>. So, maybe if those do well, it\u2019ll encourage them to bring over some classics? Fingers crossed!<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah, my thing about this question, like \u201cWe\u2019re not going to get the light novels,\u201d I wouldn\u2019t say \u201cnever,\u201d though. I think light novels are only just starting to have their time here.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: At this point, I feel like anything is possible. There\u2019s been so many series where I\u2019m like, \u201cOh, we\u2019re never gonna get that in English,\u201d and then, lo and behold, we did, so I\u2019ll just keep holding out hope forever.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I\u2019m just like, the hope is still there. Hope springs eternal.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: That\u2019s right.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: It\u2019s good. [Chuckles]<\/p>\nOkay, so, yeah, would you like to elaborate on why this is one of your favorite series and you\u2019re so desperate for those light novels?<\/p>\n
DEE<\/strong>: Well, I\u2019m desperate for the light novels because I would just like to spend more time with these characters and see where Shurei\u2019s story goes, because from the manga\u2026 again, not to spoil too much, but her journey is really just beginning by the time we get to the end of the manga. And the anime\u2026 again, I haven\u2019t been able to see season 2 because it never got an English release and by the\u2026 Anyway, we don\u2019t need to get into a conversation about fansubs!<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: But the anime gets a little deeper into her story and goes more into what happens after\u2026 redacted for spoilers!<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Redacted. [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: So that\u2019s one of the reasons I really want the light novels, is I would like to spend more time with these characters, see how they grow and change, and impact and change the world, honestly. I feel like that\u2019s where the story is going a little bit.\u00a0<\/p>\nThe reason I love it so much is\u2026 Again, Shurei\u2019s a huge part of it. She is just a terrific main character. She\u2026 I don\u2019t even know how to describe her, because she\u2019s observant and really competent and smart, but she also gets really angry at people and tells them off to their faces. She\u2019s a very layered character. I can\u2019t describe her in a couple of sentences. And I feel that way about a lot of the cast. I think that they\u2019re well-written people with a lot of internal contradictions who grow over the course of the story in ways that are really satisfying to watch.<\/p>\n
I also think it has a good sense of humor. It can be quite silly when it wants to be. I like the political intrigue elements, and I like that the romance isn\u2019t a huge part of it because I\u2019m not a\u2026 As much as I like shoujo, I tend to lean towards the shoujo where romance isn\u2019t the end-all-be-all, central, big, dramatic focus of it. You know, your Basara<\/em>s, your Ouran High<\/em>s, as some very dramatically different examples of the kind of shoujo I love.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yes! [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: So I like that about this too. I think it gives the relationships room to breathe and grow naturally as the characters weave in and out of each other\u2019s lives. So I appreciate that a lot. And it\u2019s a very endearing cast. So, I think those are the main reasons why I love this series.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah, I largely agree with those things. Reading the summaries somewhat turned off my partner. He was like, \u201cOh, Ryuki\u2026\u201d They emphasize that Ryuki sleeps with men initially but then [chuckles] gets a crush on Shurei and everything, and he\u2019s like, \u201cWhat is this?\u201d And I was like, \u201cNo\u2026\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: I love that Ryuki is canon bisexual! Can you name me a story where the love interest in manga\u2026 where the love interest is canon bisexual? That is so uncommon. And the series is generally very chill about it. They\u2019re like, \u201cYeah, he sleeps with men. He also sleeps with women. That\u2019s what he does.\u201d [Chuckles]<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I know! I think it\u2019s just from the Wikipedia summary you get the sense that he was gay but then he was turned straight. And I\u2019m like, \u201cNo, he\u2019s just bi.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Oh yeah, that is not the\u2026 I mean, it\u2019s ultimately a moot point because he does fall in love with\u2026 spoilers? I feel like it\u2019s not a spoiler.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: It\u2019s not a spoiler.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: He falls in love with Shurei pretty quick, and so he sort of stops really necessarily paying attention to other people because of that. But it doesn\u2019t change the fact that he is canon bisexual, explicitly bisexual.\u00a0<\/p>\nWhat is he called? \u201cA double-edged sword,\u201d I think, was the terminology of the time period, which I thought was a neat way of explaining it in explicit terms but still grounding it in the historical timeline, where the word \u201cbisexual\u201d probably wouldn\u2019t have existed. So, they\u2019re like, \u201cHere\u2019s a slang term they used for bi folks back in Dynastic China days.\u201d<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: [Chuckles] Yeah! No, I thought that was good, yeah. And I also really like Shurei. And I think part of the complication with her is that she has many sides, but in a story where\u2026 I don\u2019t want to spoil who is what, but they all have such duplicitousness about them that she doesn\u2019t, really, so it feels refreshing.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: She\u2019s a lot more straightforward, that\u2019s true. I also like that her\u2026 I feel like she acts differently with different people, which is, again, very true to life. Your relationships with different people impact how you behave. So, she maybe goes off on Ryuki a little bit more than she does her dad or her surrogate brother, who she has a lot more patience for.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [Chuckles] Only when her dad tries to serve her tea is she like, \u201cNo, absolutely not. Get away from me.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: [crosstalk] \u201cNo, absolutely not.\u201d Yeah, and she will be blunt when she needs to be. She knows when to be polite and navigate those etiquette spaces, but also, when she doesn\u2019t have to navigate them, she has the subtlety of a brick, and I do love that about her. She will tell you what she thinks.\u00a0<\/p>\nAnd again\u2014not to get too deep in the weeds here, because I\u2019m sure we\u2019re gonna get into themes\u2014the other thing I love about the series is it actively and directly discusses sexism in a way that I think is very nuanced and relatable, that I don\u2019t think you see as much. So, it\u2019s a story of a woman trying to enter a traditional man\u2019s sphere, and I think it handles it really well, in a way that is both painful at times but also affirming and inspiring, and I really like that about it, too.<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Yes, I felt all of those emotions. I was like, \u201cStop! I\u2019ve done this! I don\u2019t want to\u2026\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: [Chuckles]<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: \u201cI don\u2019t want this!\u201d But also, it\u2019s good! I\u2019m [like] \u201cYay, she\u2019s gonna succeed, yay!\u201d [Laughs]<\/p>\nOkay, so, hopefully, if you haven\u2019t read The Story of Saiunkoku<\/em> before, we sold you on it. So, if you want to read it, from what I saw it was pretty easily accessible. Shojo Beat<\/em> still appeared to be publishing it in print as well, or places still had stock of it, so you can get it in print. It\u2019s also available digitally. Oops, I forgot to check if the anime is anywhere legally.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: It technically is available on\u2026 As of the recording of this, it is available\u2014the first season\u2014on RetroCrush and, I think, Amazon Prime. It is listed, for some reason, under the title Colourcloud Palace<\/em>.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Oh, yeah!<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: And it is only the dub. So, if you\u2019re looking for it, you have to look up \u201cColourcloud Palace,\u201d and \u201ccolour\u201d is spelled the British way, just to make it a little bit harder for Americans to find it.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [crosstalk] Just to make it more fun!<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah! Just to bury it deeper down in the algorithm. The dub is fine. The sub has a cast of all-stars, so it\u2019s hard to compete, but I guess it\u2019s better than nothing. As soon as the sub comes out, we\u2019re gonna do a watchalong of it at AniFem for Chatty AF<\/a>, our podcast, so, come on, guys! Bring that sub over! Let\u2019s do it.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah, like, \u201cLet\u2019s do it, we got it ready!\u201d<\/p>\nOkay, so now we\u2019re gonna spoil all the things because there\u2019s a lot of things to spoil, honestly. So, if you don\u2019t want to know about those things, stop this episode now.\u00a0<\/p>\n
And here we go! We\u2019re going to talk about some more characters because there are a lot of them and they all, again, have five different identities to unravel!<\/p>\n
[Laughter]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: So that\u2019s fun. And I apologize in advance that I\u2019m definitely gonna mess up their names. I\u2019m gonna mix up who I\u2019m talking about because half of them have names that are very similar to each other, and I\u2019m like, oh no!<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: If I get confused, I\u2019ll ask for clarification. So, we\u2019ll get through it. It\u2019ll be alright.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yes. I\u2019m just like, I remember some subtweets about me mispronouncing the Basara<\/em> protag a while ago, so, you know, just subtweet me again, everybody. [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: It happens when you\u2019re talking, right? I mean, pobody\u2019s nerfect.<\/p>\n[Chuckling]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Exactly. Okay, so we talked a lot about Shurei already, but we haven\u2019t really talked about Ryuki. [Chuckles] Oh, Ryuki.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Ryuki is also a character with layers. What do you think about him? Because this is your first time through. So I\u2019m curious, first time through, what are your thoughts on Ryuki?<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: He did grate on me. I was like, you are too silly.<\/p>\n[Chuckling]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: I like his whole thing where he\u2019s pretending to be a fool, and actually he\u2019s not. He\u2019s just like, \u201cI really wanted my brother to come\u2026 I wanted them to un-exile him and him to have to be king instead of me.\u201d Good ploy there.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah. Well, and he has so much trauma surrounding the court. With Ryuki, I always kind of have to remind myself\u2014because he definitely has that element of being sort of privileged and pampered because he is the emperor, but also, he\u2019s an abuse survivor and it\u2019s a huge part of his character. And his survival strategy of not seeming dangerous was almost certainly one of the reasons he survived to adulthood in that very cutthroat political landscape.\u00a0<\/p>\nSo, he\u2019s sad, which is\u2026 If you want to get me to love your anime boy, make him sad! [Chuckles]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: I know! I feel like I wanted that to carry through more.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: It\u2019s very emphasized in the first two volumes, when it\u2019s setting up Shurei and Ryuki\u2019s relationship. But then after that, it kind of becomes The Shurei Show and he\u2019s always just there, pining and trying to find a way to be in her life, which is always silly, and then his only serious moments come more from, like, \u201cPeople are trying to prevent Shurei from being a civil servant, and I\u2019m not gonna stand by and let that happen.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah. No, I agree. I wish we did get a little bit more of his internal character struggles outside of his relationship with Shurei as the story goes. But you know, I mean, part of that is just Shurei\u2019s the main character, so it\u2019s kinda\u2026<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Which, fine, great, I love it. [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah. What did you think of the way he handles having a crush on her but also supporting her dreams? [Chuckles]<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Oh, yes, yes. This is a part where I could see why you\u2019d really want to know more about how this goes because I\u2019m like, so far, yeah, he\u2019s doing a great job, mostly. He\u2019s doing a great job being like, \u201cHer dreams come before my wishes,\u201d where it is somewhat clear that she doesn\u2019t focus on him as much as he focuses on her and adores her and everything, and his recognition that he could force her to come, but then he would destroy everything that he likes about her.\u00a0<\/p>\nAnd I\u2019m like, yes! Most manga do not acknowledge that! They just do the terrible thing and then don\u2019t really overtly say that. It\u2019s nice.<\/p>\n
DEE<\/strong>: Yeah. I like that Ryuki\u2026 he definitely has to fight through that impulse to be like, \u201cI want to keep her with me all the time and just have her be here.\u201d And he even has that thought at the beginning, like, \u201cIf I pass this law, she\u2019ll like me more!\u201d as opposed to \u201cI should pass this law to let women take the exams because they deserve to take the exams.\u201d His motives aren\u2019t 100% pure.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I feel like overall the narrative kind of is\u2014overall, not just in this situation\u2014like motives don\u2019t matter as much as end results! [Chuckles] You know?<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: How do you mean? What\u2019s another example?<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Like, morally\u2026 Because they\u2019re all so conniving in everything.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Oh yeah.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: They\u2019re not trying to do the morally upstanding, high-road thing ever. They\u2019re like, \u201cThis is a means to an end. And if the end is good, it\u2019s good.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, I think that\u2019s why Shurei and Eigetsu are such a\u2026 like, \u201cWe\u2019ll shake the foundations of this government.\u201d I like to joke that the end of this series is a full-on proletariat revolution led by Shurei and Eigetsu.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [Laughs] Yes, yes!<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: But yeah, you\u2019re right: there\u2019s a lot of court intrigue and machinations and clans jockeying for power. And Ryuki grew up in that landscape.\u00a0<\/p>\nSo, my point was, I totally agree with you that\u2026 I really love how he acknowledges that it\u2019s important to honor Shurei\u2019s agency, but I also like that the series doesn\u2019t let him be a perfect human being, right? He still kind of has to fight through that desire to just\u2026 \u201cI\u2019m the emperor; she could just be my girlfriend if I ordered it\u201d kind of deal, and then be like, \u201cNo, no, no. Don\u2019t do that. That\u2019s wrong!\u201d Good job, Ryuki. I\u2019m proud of you.<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: \u201cThat\u2019s too far.\u201d Exactly, yeah. But it makes sense for him to think it. You always gotta think the bad thing and then not do it, right?<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah. And especially when we look at\u2026 I like the way the series\u2026 Because it takes place in Fantasy China, but there\u2019s not a ton of actual magic. The fantastical elements are very background level. There\u2019s some immortals kicking around, and later in the series, past where the manga goes, there\u2019s a few other magical (\u201csupernatural\u201d is maybe the word I should use)\u2026 that drop in very suddenly into the story. But it\u2019s pretty grounded in just day-to-day living in a world that is similar to but not exactly like Dynastic China.\u00a0<\/p>\nAnd so I like that the series\u2026 I feel like it acknowledges those historical roots by having the characters have these thoughts like \u201cOh, well, women should be in the home,\u201d and then they\u2019re having to unlearn those behaviors. Which, listen, there\u2019s plenty of people in our current day who think the same thing, but it would have been just accepted fact in that historical period. So, I do like the way that it acknowledges that and then goes, \u201cBut that\u2019s not the story we\u2019re telling. We\u2019re telling the progressive version of that story.\u201d<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah, totally. There was one point early on where I was a bit confused because I thought it implied at one point that women used to be able to take the exam but then they changed the law, and I was like, \u201cBut then why is it so vehemently opposed?\u201d And then I was like, \u201cMaybe I read that wrong.\u201d [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: I don\u2019t remember that. You could be right and I may have just missed it. But if that was the case, I think it was so long ago that it\u2019s like \u201cWe don\u2019t do things that way anymore\u201d kind of deal.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yeah, they had a whole revolution after the previous emperor and they\u2019re like, \u201cWe\u2019re a totally different country now. It\u2019s all wild and everything over here.\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, they\u2019re very much coming off of years of political unrest. So, as Shurei\u2019s\u2014<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Don\u2019t rock the boat!<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah. As Shurei\u2019s particular traumas would love to tell us: the hard times in the city.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [Chuckles] Yeah, Hard Times in the City. That\u2019s the real name of this manga.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: [Chuckles] I mean, that\u2019s one of the other things I like about it, though, is: right from the start it\u2019s like, yeah, there was all this political unrest, and at the high level\u2026 I mean, it\u2019s the Game of Thrones<\/em> idea of\u2014 I shouldn\u2019t talk about Game of Thrones<\/em> because it sucks and this is so much better. I\u2019m still angry at the end of Game of Thrones<\/em>. It\u2019s been years and I\u2019m still angry. But that idea\u2014<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: I\u2019ve always been angry.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: But that idea of, you know, when the nobles are fighting, it\u2019s the commoners who suffer the most. And Shurei, because her dad has been cut off from the main family, she was very much on the ground for that.\u00a0<\/p>\nAnd so, she and Ryuki have very different experiences of what that moment looked like, and it motivates her entire life, right? Like, \u201cI want to make sure that people have food and medicine and have the ability to make their own choices.\u201d That\u2019s her whole thing. Which, again, proletariat revolution, Shurei. Let\u2019s do it. [Chuckles]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: Let\u2019s do it! Yes, yes, yes. And\u2026 All right, this was a thought I had before and then I forgot it and now I remember again, in response to the question of Ryuki being contradictory about his desire to be with Shurei but also trying to help her and her dreams when those things don\u2019t mesh.\u00a0<\/p>\nIt feels like he is kind of in her position from the beginning, where she\u2019s like, \u201cI keep dreaming about this thing that I know is literally impossible, but I still really want to do it.\u201d And then he\u2019s like, \u201cOkay, I\u2019ll make that dream come true. But now my<\/em> dream is like, \u2018I\u2019m gonna wait for you,\u2019 even though I know that\u2019s impossible, question mark, question mark?\u201d<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Might be on-hold forever and ever? Yeah. I mean, eventually she\u2019ll retire, probably. And then they can get married.<\/p>\n[Chuckling]<\/p>\n
ASHLEY<\/strong>: They can be like 50 years old and married finally.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: That\u2019s right. And in the meantime, they can just have little garden trysts because that\u2019s their thing.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Yes, yes! Totally. They\u2019re really doing it correctly.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Mm-hm!<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: [Chuckles] Okay, well, we have some other characters to talk about, which is\u2026 Seiran is the guard of Shurei but also Ryuki\u2019s brother, but we don\u2019t acknowledge that anymore.<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: Yeah, he\u2019s basically Shurei\u2019s adoptive brother at this point, right? I mean, Shoka and her mom, whose name I always forget, took him in. So I think of him as like Shurei\u2019s older brother for the most part.<\/p>\nASHLEY<\/strong>: Okay, okay. That makes sense. I definitely like him. To me\u2026 I\u2019d written a question later here that\u2019s like: which character did the best at forging a new identity or staying the same? And for me, it\u2019s so interesting that they all have 50 million identities going around and Seiran is the one who\u2019s like, \u201cI definitely just don\u2019t acknowledge that I used to be a prince, and I will not respond to Ryuki keep calling me brother,\u201d and he knows that and catches himself. \u201cI shut that down entirely.\u201d [Chuckles]<\/p>\nDEE<\/strong>: \u201cYour brother is dead.\u201d Wink! [Chuckles]<\/p>\n
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